Between Me And A Christian American Man...!!! [الأرشيف]

أبو الرحيل

24/04/2007, 07:21 PM

I will try to part the debate because it's pretty much long.....!!!:o

By the way he is about 51 years old i think or even older but i did have fun with that dude....!!!:rolleyes:

Here is what he said:

{{{

I read today that a Muslim doctor is saying we are profiling him because he has been checked three times while getting on an airplane. I think it's time to get answers from those who claim their terrorist members do not represent them. This is pretty long, but worth reading. I've read it a couple times. I wasn't sure if I should post it or not. I've decided to go ahead with it. This is something that’s very important to me, because I have children to try to explain things to, and most of the time I don’t know how. How can you tell your child to not fear a Muslim? How can you assure them that the guy in line behind you is harmless? How do you even know that? I have to say that the Muslim in our cities worries me. I read about 2 hours a day about things that stick with me for weeks. I usually don't write about these things, since the news is filled with so much. Read this if you get the time. Its something I think everyone should give a bit of thought.

"I've been trying to say this since 9-11 but you worry me. I wish you didn't. I wish when I walked down the streets of this country that I love, that your color and culture still blended with the beautiful human landscape we enjoy in this country. But you don't blend in anymore. I notice you, and it worries me. I notice you because I can't help it anymore. People from your homelands, professing to be Muslims, have been attacking and killing my fellow citizens and our friends for more than 20 years now. I don't fully understand their grievances and hate but I know that nothing can justify the inhumanity of their attacks. On September 11, nineteen ARAB-MUSLIMS hijacked four jetliners in my country. They cut the throats of women in front of children and brutally stabbed to death others. They took control of those planes and crashed them into buildings killing thousands of proud fathers, loving sons, wise grandparents, elegant daughters, best friends, favorite coaches, fearless public servants, and children's mothers. The Palestinians Celebrated, The Iraqis were overjoyed as was most of the Arab world.

So I notice you now. I don't want to be worried. I don't want to be consumed by the same rage and hate and prejudice that has destroyed the soul of these terrorists. But I need your help. As a rational American, trying to protect my country and family in an irrational and unsafe world, I must know how to tell the difference between you, and the Arab/Muslim terrorist. How do I differentiate between the true Arab/Muslim-Americans and the Arab/Muslims in our communities who are attending our schools, enjoying our parks, and living in OUR communities under the protection of OUR constitution, while they plot the next attack that will slaughter these
same good neighbors and children? The events of September 11th changed the answer.

It is not my responsibility to determine which of you embraces our
great country, with ALL of its religions, with ALL of its different citizens, with all of its faults. It is time for every Arab/Muslim in this country to determine it for me. I want to know, I demand to know, and I have a right to know whether or not you love America . Do you pledge allegiance to its flag? Do you proudly display it in front of your house, or on your car? Do you pray in your many daily prayers that Allah will bless this nation, that He will protect and prosper it? Or do you pray that Allah with
destroy it in one of your "Jihads"? Are you thankful for the freedom that only this nation affords? A freedom that was paid for by the blood of hundreds of thousands of patriots who gave their lives for this country? Are you willing to preserve this freedom by paying the ultimate sacrifice? Do you love America ?

If this is your commitment, then I need YOU to start letting ME know about it. Your Muslim leaders in this nation should be flooding the media at this time with hard facts on your faith, and what hard actions you are taking as a community and as a religion to protect the United States of America. Please, no more benign pronouncing of regret for the death of the innocent because I worry about who you regard as innocent .

I am not interested in any more sympathy... I am only
interested in action. What will you do for America - our great country -- at this time of crisis, at this time of war? I want to see Arab-Muslims waving the AMERICAN flag in the streets. I want to hear you chanting "Allah Bless America " I want to see young Arab/Muslim men enlisting in the military. I want to see a commitment of money, time, and emotion to the victims of this butchering and to this nation as a whole. The FBI has a list of over 400 people they want to talk to regarding the WTC attack. Many of these people live and socialize in Muslim communities. You know them. You know where they are. Hand them over to us, now! But I have seen little even approaching this sort of action. Instead I have seen an already closed and secretive community close even tighter. You have disappeared from the streets. You have posted armed security guards at your facilities. You have threatened lawsuits. You have screamed for protection from reprisals. The very few Arab/Muslim representatives that HAVE appeared in the media were defensive and only woried about the well being of the Muslim US citizens. They seemed more concerned with making sure that the United States proves who was responsible before taking action. They seemed more concerned with protecting their fellow Muslims from violence directed towards them in the United States and abroad than they did with supporting our country and denouncing "leaders" like Khadafi, Hussein, Farrakhan, and Arafat. If the true teachings of Islam proclaim tolerance and peace and love for all people then I want chapter and verse from the Koran and statements from popular Muslim leaders to back it up.
What good is it if the teachings in the Koran are good and pure and true when your "leaders" are teaching fanatical interpretations, terrorism, and intolerance? It matters little how good Islam SHOULD BE if large numbers of the world's Muslims interpret the teachings of Mohammed incorrectly and adhere to a degenerative form of the religion. A form that has been demonstrated to us over and over again. A form whose structure is built upon a foundation of violence, death, and suicide. A form whose members are recruited from the prisons around the world. A form whose members (some as young as five years old) are seen day after day, week in and week out, year after year, marching in the streets around the world, burning effigies of our presidents, burning the American flag, shooting weapons into the air. A form whose members convert from a peaceful religion, only to take! Up arms against the United States of America, the country of their birth. A form whose rules are so twisted, that their traveling members refuse to show their faces at airport security checkpoints, in the name of Islam.

Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because our women proudly show their faces in public rather than cover up like a shameful ? Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we drink wine with dinner, or celebrate Christmas? Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we have befriended Israel, the ONLY FRIENDLY CIVILIZED SOCIETY in the Muslim/Arab area, that thinks and acts like most Americans. And if you and your fellow Muslims hate us, then why in the world are you even here? Are you here to take our money? Are you here to undermine our peace and stability? Are you here to destroy us? If so, I want you to leave. I want you to go back to your desert sandpit where women are treated like rats and dogs. I want you to take your religion, your friends, and your family back to your Islamic extremists, and STAY THERE! We will NEVER give in to your influence, your retarded mentality, your twisted, violent, intolerant religion. We will NEVER allow the attacks of September 11, or any others for that matter, to take away that which is so precious to us: Our rights under the greatest constitution in the world. I'd like to know where every Arab/ Muslim in this country stands and I think it is my right and the right of every true citizen of this country to demand it. A right paid for by the blood of thousands of my brothers and sisters who died protecting the very constitution that is protecting you and your family. If you are here as my brother, my neighbor, my friend, as a fellow American. Then there can be no gray areas or feelings and beliefs regarding your allegiance and it is up to YOU, to show ME, where YOU stand." "Until then .. you worry me"
I hope this didn’t offend anyone. Just something that I think needs to be said.
If you made it this far Thanks For reading ...appreciated

}}}

To Be Continued with my Replay...!!!:)

مخاطب الوجدان

24/04/2007, 07:47 PM

this one is pretty long .. but I 've read it ..
waiting for your reply?

باتونيان

24/04/2007, 09:47 PM

Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because our women proudly show their faces in public rather than cover up like a shameful ?

This specific sentence would provoke me to reply to to his nonsense !!
I will be back with more comments and my point of view on his article.

But first, was it a thread by him and a reply by you or did the discussion go on?

اسوارة الياسمين

24/04/2007, 10:17 PM

Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because our women proudly show their faces in public rather than cover up like a shameful ? Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we drink wine with dinner, or celebrate Christmas? Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we have befriended Israel, the ONLY FRIENDLY CIVILIZED SOCIETY in the Muslim/Arab area, that thinks and acts like most Americans. And if you and your fellow Muslims hate us, then why in the world are you even here? Are you here to take our money? Are you here to undermine our peace and stability? Are you here to destroy us? If so, I want you to leave. I want you to go back to your desert sandpit where women are treated like rats and dogs. I want you to take your religion, your friends, and your family back to your Islamic extremists, and STAY THERE! We will NEVER give in to your influence, your retarded mentality, your twisted, violent, intolerant religion. We will NEVER allow the attacks of September 11, or any others for that matter, to take away that which is so precious to us: Our rights under the greatest constitution in the world. I'd like to know where every Arab/ Muslim in this country stands and I think it is my right and the right of every true citizen of this country to demand it. A right paid for by the blood of thousands of my brothers and sisters who died protecting the very constitution that is protecting you and your family. If you are here as my brother, my neighbor, my friend, as a fellow American. Then there can be no gray areas or feelings and beliefs regarding your allegiance and it is up to YOU, to show ME, where YOU stand." "Until then .. you worry me"
I hope this didn’t offend anyone. Just something that I think needs to be said.
If you made it this far Thanks For reading ...appreciated

}}}

To Be Continued with my Replay...!!!:)

I really dont understand whyAmerican are so dum.. they are so blind I dont want to show how angrey Iam after I read these words, it made me really furious,
But i will wait till I ll see what you replied to him

Caribbean Dream

25/04/2007, 09:28 AM

Words written with the pen of blind wrath and hatred:o

Show this poor man the path of reason:o

أفق

25/04/2007, 12:51 PM

Dear..

I'm waiting your reply to him :)

Take care!

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 01:00 PM

this one is pretty long .. but I 've read it ..
waiting for your reply?

it's coming up...!!

Thanks for stoppin by...!!

Peace...!!
This specific sentence would provoke me to reply to to his nonsense !!
I will be back with more comments and my point of view on his article.

But first, was it a thread by him and a reply by you or did the discussion go on?

it did go on till he had nothing to say except rereading my replay...!!;)

Peace...!!
I really dont understand whyAmerican are so dum.. they are so blind I dont want to show how angrey Iam after I read these words, it made me really furious,
But i will wait till I ll see what you replied to him

one of things i told him that don't generalize when you make a Decision ....!!!:)

Peace...!!
Words written with the pen of blind wrath and hatred:o

Show this poor man the path of reason:o

I agree....!!

Dear..

I'm waiting your reply to him :)

Take care!

Well Well Well....!!

Look Who is visiting today....!!!:rolleyes:

How have you been dude....??!!

Hope things are working just fine with ya....!!!

Glad to see ya here...!!!

Peace...!!

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 01:03 PM

Before i paste the replay...!!

plz ingore the mistakes you read and remember a thought that it took from him a line to write in, it took maybe 5 lines from me....!!! LOL

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 04:05 PM

My Replay to him:

{{{

After greetings:

since you said in ur post that this is very important to you then I am expecting an answer from you for my point of view.
The very first question I hope you ask yourself about, "why Arabs?" , "why not Americans Muslims", why not European Muslims,…why the camera is focusing on Arabs precisely…!!
I will answer you why..! before 11/9 , everyday we hear the same news which was about Israel and Palestine.. the whole world is just watching since 1945, they just watch and that’s it, they don’t even discuss who is right and who is wrong..!! because they are afraid to find the answer.! And after 11/9 all the news now about Muslims or let me be clear and say "Arabs".!

I wanna tell you first that I am Arabian, and I am a Muslim so I hope you will have the answer for your questions in my post!
And before I start explaining about Islam so u will close ur ears and shut ur eyes , why don’t I ask you about Christianity and if u prove me wrong I swear I am going to exchange my religion to Christian today before tomorrow.

You guys claim that there is one god, on the other hand you say that there are three in one and one in three, and when anyone try to find out , they will tell you its over the limit of the brain's ability to find out. You guys claim that the Christianity is the real one, while I don’t see one actual affection of the religion on the believers, how? What does the bible say about the raper, and what does the bible say about the killer, what does the bible say about praying, is it just sitting every Sunday in a wooden chair and listen to a speech, that most of the time will get you lost because of the many names in it. Actually you don’t have to attend to church so u can say, it mentioned nothing about praying.?! You kept attacking the religion that its greetings is not a word that consist of two letters which are "H" and "I", its greetings is a praying that "the peace ,the blessing and the mercy of Allah be upon you!" Leave the religion Islam for a while and lets me and you wonder in the Christianity which u claim that Americans believe in while I see today most –if not all-" are Jewish believers in a Christianity name. you kept talking about how unsafe you and your kids are feeling, but you think the "Arabians Muslims" in Palestine , feel safe with their kids when they walk around in their country. If you want to talk about something then be fair, if you think USA is your country and you have the right to feel as much of safety as possible then also the Palestinian kid should feels the same way…don’t you agree?!.
And if you r lost on how to tell ur kid to not just fear a Muslim, then that’s easy, cuz in Arabian's countries you will be lost on how to tell Arabs on how to "trust" Americans. We live in the same earth and we believe in the rules that don’t judge me by what others do even if they are my nation or they are in my side and as long as its not me who has done it then why are you taking me to the court and punishing me instead of them. And I will tell you how can I be more fair than you. We all saw what did American's Christians do in "abu gharib" prison when they had sex and violated male Iraqis which are "Arabian Muslims", is that what the bible say to the Christians invaders and is that how Christians should behave when they invade a country. Go read the history from A to Z and I bet my life If u ever find that kind of behavior from Muslims or more precisely "Arabian Muslims". On the other hand I didn’t say that’s Christianity, while in ur point of view when u called "Arabian Muslims" are terrorists because of the attack on 11/9 , then I should believe from today that all Christians are , according to what those Americans soldiers did in the "abu gharib" prison. plus, up till today no one can 100% say the attack was Arabian, yeah cuz the CIA itself viewed some strange points, such as: where were all the radars and the satellite technology in the day of the attack, and more of clever question that people like you should read about. I am not defending Arabs, but you live in the freedom country , so before you ask what the person did, ask why did he do that. And lets get back to this word "terrorist" , which is the main aim from what happened in 11/9, here is a fair question and please don’t run away from it,: define the word "terrorism" , and define the word "terrorist", is it a person who brings fears in others , then I am telling you that USA represented in BUSH and his government are the main terrorists, and enough what they are doing in iraq as a prove to satisfy that definition, and enough what Israelis doing in Palestine as a prove to satisfy the definition again. But if you just want to stick a nickname without knowing what are you sticking, then let me tell you proudly how ignorant I think you are.

And if it is about the huge number of the deaths on 9/11, then go read the news and find out how many Americans soldiers died in this war, and come answer me if u have the guts for it. And you talked about the " nineteen ARAB-MUSLIMS hijacked four jetliners in my country. They cut the throats of women in front of children and brutally stabbed to death others", assuming that’s true, even so we both know how much of lies-especially in the US- the media can bring us, why you never asked yourself what does the country of freedom doing to "gowantanamo prisoners" which half of them are teens, why do u just look from one side, have you ever seen a kid or a baby getting killed in his mother's lap, or have u closed ur eyes from what happened just two days ago in Israel when a 1 years old baby got killed by Israelis soldiers. What I bring you is facts, not assumptions from Jewish media that it might be true or wrong. And let me ask you few questions here just to balance your ideas with what happened in 11/9, while I am begging you to be fair and tell me if they are ever balanced. How many fathers are killed in this Christianity war against "Arabian Muslim country" which is Iraq, how many mothers are abused and how many children have lost their parents, how many futures have been destroyed and how many houses and families have been dragged to the hell, do the comparing and tell me that USA or should I say Americans Christians is what Christianity is all about. I think this can can answer all ur questions about 11/9. " how come usa say to arabs, leave us alone in one side and in another side they say we invade your countries to help you", seriously open your mind just a lil bit!

-----------------------------------------------

There was a good question in your topic over there which show how ignorant do u live there and how much of nothing you know about "Muslims or Islam" except what you have taught in the Jewish media. Here is ur question " How do I differentiate between the true Arab/Muslim-Americans and the Arab/Muslims in our communities". you gotta understand that there is no "American Muslims and Arabian Muslims" there is one Islam, what American Muslims believe in, is the exact same what Arabian Muslims believe in, but that was a clever move to run from the facts , you think an American Muslim can hate an Arabian Muslim because he is Arabian, or the reverse.. a thousand "no" for that question, what you saw in the day of the 11/9 when Arabs were celebrating and happy for what happened.. that's something normal, cuz it’s a desire of the revenge from the one who kept hitting you, so when you see something had happened to him you will be happy…, all what Arabs heard that day that the US got hit, so they smiled, they had no idea what does this represent or what was meant behind it, but tell me you wont get happy if you heard that a huge explosion preformed by Americans happened in the town of where Usama bin ladin live.. you wont even read what are the results cuz to you he is an enemy and you will feel that way automatically without realizing. I hope here I clarified something.

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 04:21 PM

Now about burning the flag and….etc!!!

the word "jihad" has always been scary to all un-Muslims –actually even Arabian Muslims presidents are scared of this word nowadays- but especially Americans, since it is the most country’s suffering from it in Iraq and Afghanistan right now! But I am gonna ask you what do u know about "jihad" beside what the Jewish media taught you! And most of the "jihad" rules are already into you but you don’t want to admit it cuz you are afraid of admitting the truth and here is the prove. I read from your post that you have kids so u know how it feel to be a father right now, tell me what would you do if you saw someone is killing your kid in front of your eyes, -without looking at what he believes in or what so ever- …!!
I want you to know that "jihad" is a reaction for an action, and its meaning is to get my right with the force if you don’t give it to me with peace.. and that’s how I said you do believe in that! We all are born free in this life so who the hell are you to force me to perform your rules or your belief in my country or in my people, who the hell are you to judge what my women wear or what my men look like or what my kids like to do or say…!!

Again, I am not just sayin words here.. I am talking facts! Do u know that USA has exchanged most of the school books in our countries, and do u know that most of the –Arabian presidents- rules are Americans rules,…! Why is the country of freedom forcing other countries to follow its style, from that, when u see a kid burning the American flag, it’s cuz the flag represent the American government, and that much of hate they have for it, they don’t hate this guy or that girl, but they hate the government which is representing the country. America and its organizations have always talked and yelled about how to not judge by the appearance, and have always talked about freedom and democracy but when it comes to "Arabs" the first thing they do is they upside-down the rules and they judge us in an unfairly way.!---------------------------------------------------------

About your request when you said"" I want to see young Arab/Muslim men enlisting in the military….etc"
You gotta understand, that it is forbidden to kill in Islam, that’s the general rule in Islam, and who kills will deserve the death penalty, that rule works both for Muslims and un-Muslims equally…!! Again here I am begging you to be fair.! Do you really think that what USA is doing in the other side of the world, something right!! Do you really think invading Afghanistan –a Muslim country- and then invading Iraq – a Muslim country- , and next will be Iran which is also a Muslim country,..!!! is this what all the Christianity about, do you think that just because Saddam was a bad guy, America has the right to kill over 150,000 –Arabian Muslims- , or do you think under the claim of looking for Usama bin ladin , America has the right to kill more than 200,000 –of muslims-… and be honest and tell me that most of the victims are not innocents, I am begging you to ask yourself first, why they hate us, don’t ask them , do you hate us, cuz if you really want to be fair then ask for the reasons that make those people reach the level of turning themselves to a timing bomb, that may explode any second.
This is why they rather to either be against US or stay at home, rather than holding a gun and killing poor women and innocent kids..!!

------------------------------

And when you said "If the true teachings of Islam proclaim tolerance and peace and love for all people then I want chapter and verse from the Koran and statements from popular Muslim leaders to back it up"
isn't it enough that the Muslim's greetings is a praying of peace and mercy and blessing to you, isn't it enough that killing Muslims and un-Muslims is equal and have the same penalty, isn't it enough that when a Muslim and un-Muslim face each other in court then the judge should go with fair rules, without looking at what the other side believe, isn't it enough that Islam has allowed to a Muslim to marry –Christians ,Jewish) women, that’s right, cuz it didn’t look when it comes to love and family to the religion but moreover to the love that will produce the peace. I have to tell you something here, when you want to read, know , find out about Islam, don’t tell me Osama bin ladin represent the religion and we have to make bin ladin straight , no…! when you want to find out about Islam and its principles , then go to the source and read yourself, don’t tell me this one is doing this and that one is doing that, otherwise its enough what we have seen Christians doing all over the world and we didn’t stick it to their principles , they have learnt in the bible to –love the neighbor as yourself- and they asked Muslims who do you love the most , and when they found out that our prophet is who we love the most, they went drawing his pictures having sex with young ladies , and other kind of that crap! My question, show me what you have learnt in the bible , all what I see is insultion to the religion "Islam" under the name of freedom, and what did America said when that attitude happened,….'freedom is freedom', how come for the freedom of the Christians to forbid to the woman to wear what she wants and allow drawing sex photos about the prophets and messengers…!! And at the top of that , you will see the pop will show up and humiliate the "Muslims prophet" under the same claim of freedom… you gotta be fair here, and please find me the answer for this.!

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 04:27 PM

And when you said " Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because our women proudly show their faces in public rather than cover up like a shameful ?"
First of all I will assume that you were so mad when you typed that sentence, and second I do have American friends, and no matter what they do or what they wear, I can’t lift up my tongue and describe all Americans women what you have described ours.
You have to understand first that the veil thing is a culture thing, and before Islam comes , "Arabian women" wear that, it’s a tradition that they enjoy to do, and I don’t understand the fuss about that, Americans have tattoos all over their body, in their boobs and in their asses, and none of the Arabs described that as what you have described, all what I say is that’s also their tradition, and as long it doesn’t bother anyone then I can accept it, but lets take a look now since you opened that issue in that way, and please answer me:
Do we hate you because most of your women are in the x-rated channels videotaping having sex while they are wearing the golden cross in their necks, or do we hate you because in your case the woman either to be a nun or to be-what you have describe a proud- , what's the story behind the nuns buddy, why they are not allowed to get married, and why their dress is exactly similar to Muslims women dress, how come you never thought of that before, did Mary –peace be upon her- used to wear a cover when she gave birth to Jesus , how did Mary used to dress as an example of the right dress for Christians, where are you Christians from the nun and her rights, is she allowed to get married, what kind of life is she living, if she believes in the same religion you believe in then how come she and others wear different, what's the same, there has to be one right and another wrong! Plz find me the answers! I am looking forward for them!
"
In Oman we have female Ministers, female ambassadors, female Directors of mutli-billion dollar businesses in addition to full time mothers, engineers and bankers, we are still Arabs, and still Muslims.

For some reason, Western media has decided that Muslims and Arabs are one and the same, regardless of the fact that according to CNN Islam is the fastest growing religion. One would question why this would be the case, why are so many people embracing Islam if it is a religion of terrorists who oppress women? The reason is because most of the people who convert do their homework, and learn to differentiate between Islam and some poor practices of individuals. In particular for females, through their homework, they come to realise that Islam is one of the most liberating religions to have ever existed for humanity, and it explicitly values femininity and the female. If we look at thousands of years of history from the Ancient Chinese, Hindus, Pharaohs, Babylonians, Assyrians, Pagans, Romans, Persians, Jews, Christians and current Western Civilisation - there is certifiable evidence that none of these civilizations or religions respected and protected women to the same extent as Islam does. This is because Islam recognised all of the oppressing behaviours of prior religions and civilizations and prescribed rules in order to abolish them. Furthermore, Islam is a religion for all time and its content is relevant to all generations, those of the past, the current and the future, as the human instinct does not change with time.
To give you a brief overview of some of the rights of women in Islam:
1. The rights of a wife - In order for a marriage to be valid in Islam, a man must first provide the woman with a wedding gift called the "mahr" which should be cash and could additionally include property, jewellery and clothing. This gift is to ensure that the woman is financially secure regardless of divorce. Even if they divorce the day after they consummate the marriage the gift is for her to keep.

Furthermore, a husband is obliged in Islam to financially provide for his wife and cover ALL household and clothing bills for his family. If he does not do so it is considered a sin. In return the wife is obliged to take care of his children and be intimate with him. She is not obliged to cook, clean and stay at home, it is her choice to do so if she wishes.

In Islam there are 5 core goals that a husband and wife should strive for in their marriage: 1. Tranquillity, 2. Affection, 3. Mercy, 4. To protect and give comfort (the direct translation is to be each other's clothing) and 5. To have and raise children. Everything that a husband and wife do in a marriage should have these goals in mind - therefore, physical abuse does not comply with mercy, adultery and arguing does not comply with tranquillity, abstaining from sex and ignoring one another does not comply with being affectionate.

Furthermore, a woman is not obliged to marry anyone she doesn't want to and the Sheikh (religious man) asks for her consent before conducting the wedding ceremony. In addition a woman in Islam does not take the name of her husband, but retains her own name and identity, and this is symbolic of the marriage in that it is a joining of two individuals who come together to enhance each others lives and not to become one.

2. The rights of women in divorce- There are clear rules with regards to divorce, conditions in which it is allowed, what the process is and the rights of the woman who is divorced. Most of these rules are there to protect the woman. An example is that a man who wants to divorce his wife has to leave the house and he cannot kick her out, it is her choice if she wishes to remain in the residence.

3. Financial independence - Any money that a woman earns in her employment or inheritance is hers and she is not obliged to pay or contribute a cent to her husband or parents, it is her choice if she wants to lighten their financial load. If she financially contributes she is granted blessings from God, but if a man requests her to financially contribute he has committed a sin.

4. Inheritance rights of a woman- In Islam inheritance rights are stipulated in great detail in order to avoid arguments and disappointments. Furthermore, it is the first religion to clearly state the inheritance rights of women. This is in order to ensure her financial security. If we look at the UK just over a century ago women were kicked out of their homes upon the death of their fathers or husbands and were not allowed to inherit. Islam prescribed these rules to protect her over 1400 years ago.

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 04:29 PM

5. Mothers in Islam- Motherhood is seen as one of the most important roles of humans and mothers are given great importance and respect. In fact the Prophet says that "paradise is under the feet of mothers". Children are obliged to show the utmost respect for their parents. In fact in Islam it says that first you must show respect and obedience to God, secondly his Prophet, thirdly the mother, fourth the mother, fifth the mother, sixth the father.

6. The Hijab (headscarf)- Women in Islam are seen as jewels that should not be exploited for the satisfaction of men. The Islamic dress code demands respect and preserves your self worth. It is in fact an interesting dichotomy that in the West the headscarf is seen as an oppression of women and we find it a liberation of women. In Islam, a woman has many different dimensions to her all of which have a time and place. When she is in an intimate relationship with her husband she is obviously sexual and hence her beautiful and seductive attributes are exposed, but there is no need for her to be sexy anywhere else. At work or in public she is viewed to have integrity, a mind, a voice, it is her soul which is displayed to the world as that is what they should be focusing on, not her sexuality. Perhaps it is a very simplistic way at looking at life, but we all joke that men can't multitask, and if they see a sexy woman they will certainly be thinking of one thing, instead of focusing on what she is actually there for, to work, to contribute, to think, to converse with. The Islamic dress code simplifies interaction between males and females and makes it clear what your purpose is through your dress. The dress code is also significantly correlated to the self esteem of a women. When a woman dresses modestly in public there is no confusion as to whether she is given attention or opportunities because or her rights and capabilities or because of her sex appeal. Therefore the primary purpose of the Islamic female dress is to ensure that woman are not seen sexual objects to be exploited or manipulated into believing that their only value comes from their sexuality.

7. The value of female capabilities as opposed to trying to be like a man- On a spiritual level men and women are considered equal, however on a physical level there is a difference between them and their strengths and weaknesses. In Islam a man and a woman are two different entities that have been created to complement one another. Both should be equally valued. The prime focus is that a woman does not need to behave like a man to be successful, worthy or valued. If she chooses to she could, but why would she want to? She has her own strengths and capabilities and that is what makes her valuable. Furthermore, men should also not behave like women. In Islam, a woman is not restricted to what type of job or role she can take on, but she is asked to give priority to being a mother if she has been blessed with children to ensure that her children receive the love and nurturing that they require.

8. Education- The first word of the Quran brought down to the Prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) was 'Read!'. Education, reading, acquiring knowledge, travel and exploring and appreciating what the world has to offer is one of the fundamental values in Islam, and its importance is demonstrated by being the first thing that God communicated of the Quran. All Muslims are required to educate themselves regardless of being male or female, in fact the Prophet emphasised that women have a right to education.

9. The story of Adam and Eve. In the biblical story of Adam and Eve, Eve is portrayed as the temptress, who tempted Adam to eat the apple and hence they were expelled from heaven. In Islam, the story is quite different and symbolic. It states that they both ate from the apple, neither tempted the other and hence were equally guilty.

Above are just a few items we thought we should highlight, there are dozens or rules and examples in Islam that demonstrate the liberation and importance of women and one could write many volumes. Of course in practice, not all of these rules are applied all the time. Similarly, just because you are a Christian or a Jew, doesn't mean you won't lie, steal or kill. But there is a major distinction between the religion of Islam and the implementation of the religion by humans. It seems as though the media only focuses on poor implementation, but never looks at what is really expected of Muslims. It never focuses on the people or groups of people who correctly implement Islam."

These are some facts I lived with, here in my Arabian country, and if you wanna see it with your own eyes then come here and check it!

-------------------------------------------------------------------

When you said " Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we drink wine with dinner, or celebrate Christmas?"

First of all I want you to bring me a prove from the bible that wine is allowed according to your religion, there are so much of things you don’t know about Christianity , rather than knowing about others religions, what did the "wine" did to your families, and what did the "wine" do to your cars drivers, what have the "Wine" done to the women, you have really to find out, go to one of the police station and asks them to give you the facts of numbers of the accidents happened because of this "wine", I am not here to give you a speech on how harmful is the "wine" for the brain and the body, cuz thanks to your doctors which most of them are Christians have already proved that, and from the proves that your doctors brought, that’s why the religion we believe in forbid the wine to be drunk. You see, you guys have the claim and the prove in ur both hands, all what you are asked for is to be fair, at least when you say you believe in something then I might respect what you believe in.
About the celebration of Christmas, I don’t see why an "Arabian Muslim" would be jealous of that, but anywho…!!
I am gonna ask you this question?! Why Christians celebrate Christmas, what is the actual reason for celebrating Christmas and what do people think about nowadays when they celebrate it!! You gotta admit that most of the celebration that Christians have, are unreal ones, or you can say has been changed to be something moreover of commercial celebration! I am not Christian but I myself was looking into the celebration and its fact and I just smiled! I didn’t call the celebrators names or F words! They have the right to celebrate but I just wanted to open your mind for that spot so you will get that there is nothing in there to hate you because you celebrate that buddy!

أبو الرحيل

25/04/2007, 04:38 PM

And here is a honest answer for your last question " Do you and your fellow Muslims hate us because we have befriended Israel , the ONLY FRIENDLY CIVILIZED SOCIETY in the Muslim/Arab area, that thinks and acts like most Americans." YES AND OH YES! You can say , that’s the main reason behind the flame that is coming out of our eyes when we just hear the word "America".! And again I am begging you to be fair…!!

What kind of friendly society that kills more than 1565 kids and women in two weeks using a forbidden weapons and bombs which were provided from the US, in the recent war of Israel and Lebanon!

You have to understand that this civilized society which you kept referring to, doesn’t belong to the Muslim/Arab area, that’s why it acts like Americans!
And to save my time as well as your precious time, all what I am asking you is "does Americans themselves, believe that Israel is a friendly country"..!!
Plus lets face it, there are more than 1 billion Muslims all over the world who are ready to enter the war against Israel, so sooner or later this war will happen, and what is delaying it is the protection of the US, the Protection of the Christians, the protection of the people that have in their bible , Christians should give up their safety, their money, their souls and their future to protect Jewish,…! I am not sad for that, the only thing I have been sad for is what does those teen soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan do to die that way, where is the rights of the bible to save them at least one right which is living a life! All what America doing is preventing anything harmful will happen to the Jewish, that’s why you see its military all over the middle east! Again I am begging you to be fair here..!! what does an American soldier from across the world doing in a desert , some of them have no idea what they came for! If Israel got advantages of the Christians by exchanging some lines in their bible which were" Jesus wont come to the earth unless a country called Israel is established" then Islam didn’t try to get advantages of that, Islam is asking you to open your eyes and your mind and see what's going on! We all know that the Islamic civilization used to be the most powerful at certain time, and it was so easy to do what Jewish had done but , that’s the difference between the peace religion and the blood religion!
Anyways, there is so much to talk about this point, and if you are interested I'm ready to discuss it with ya, point by point!
--------------------------------------------------------
Your conclusion was " If so, I want you to leave. I want you to go back to your desert sandpit where women are treated like rats and dogs. I want you to take your religion, your friends, and your family back to your Islamic extremists, and STAY THERE! We will NEVER give in to your influence, your retarded mentality, your twisted, violent, intolerant religion."

Before you ask that question! Ask your people! What are you guys doing all over the middle east, what are Americans doing with their air force, marines, navy and the army all over the middle east! Have you ever asked yourself how many Americans are in the middle east! Have you ever asked yourself where is the petrol you consume to live, comes from! Have you ever asked yourself…?!!
And if those Arabian Muslims staid in America as doctors and engineers then I am telling you that Americans are here as soldiers and navies…! Which do you think should worry more, you or me ?! and about taking your money, and enjoying your parks? Go ask your government and the free oil production that is going to the US under the name of contracts and other fake deals, who is the stealer you or me?! And if we just enjoyed ur parks for some seconds, you guys have destroyed anything called a park in our countries and moreover you removed the word "smile" or "peace" in my country, then there was no place for them to go to except the country that did the bad things to them, and instead of feeling the guilt of what you have done in their country you are asking them to leave..?!! cuz that’s what the bible teach you I guess!!
You have to remember, the Arabians countries, doesn’t need the US in any single part of their life, you have to understand that the Arabians country have all the facilities to be the most powerful thing on this earth, and the problem is in our presidents which are supported by the US and made them Gods that the nation should bow to them, you know nothing about how the Arabians nations are suffering from the pressure that USA is performing on us here in our countries, so some of them have rather to travel to the US so they will bow to one god even with the accusing of whatsoever than bowing to humans, but you have also to remember , that if today is yours then tomorrow is not, and when that day will come you will understand what I mean when I tell you that we don’t need the US into any particular part of our lives.-

--------------------------------------------

Some last points I want you to put between your two eyes:

1-Islam is a religion that is supported by the only creator on this earth, so if the whole world including its goblins stand in front of it, they will never win! And the prove is, since 1945 up till 2006 and yet Israel couldn’t remove something called Islam in there, while its working everything reach their hands to do it but they cant! Try to find out why?!... USA has been in Afghanistan for almost 6 years now and up till today they can not say we are winning! While they are fighting people who hold wooden stick! In Iraq it has been more than 3 years now and the amount of the Americans death is reaching 3000 people which is the same number of the 11/9.. and yet nothing is under their control while they claim they are the most powerful country.

2- Islam doesn’t need more believers, and the number of believers doesn’t affect its position as the best religion or the number 1 religion, again read the history and you will find out what I mean.

3- I always say when you see a bad driver driving a car and he made an accident, don’t blame the car but blame the driver, same goes with Islam and Muslims, why are you blaming the religion because you saw this or that doing something, read about Islam and find out its principles and then come talk and blame!

4- In the Koran, Allah has mentioned that if he wanted everyone to believe in the same religion and make the world in peace, he can do it, but you have to realize that this is a test, so there has to be something right and something wrong, and its your duty to find out, because I wouldn’t go to heaven if you believed in Islam and I wouldn’t go to hell if you didn’t, what you believe is for your benefit, not mine!

5- Remember there are 22 Arabian countries and Oman is one of them, have you ever seen an Omani in the news for doing something bad in America or any other parts of the world, why do you blame all Arabs while only few nationalities of them who have been bad. And remember if you "the Americans" find it ok to call yourself dogs and rats then we don’t ! so please be careful when you throw words.

6- Remember, Arabs are one of the biggest civilizations, it has a history and it has a religion and it has a culture, so don’t mix everything up and judge them at impact to run away from a replay.

7- When you think you have the right to ask where those Arabians from, I think you should also ask yourself where are you from cuz both me and you know the history of USA and we both know how it has been establish…! Perhaps u need to read about the Indians and what your great grandfathers have done to them, perhaps you need to find out where is the origin of yourself because you and I are 100% sure that either you will be Asian or European or Indian.! That’s what the history has proved!

8- You and me are just citizens, we are not leaders who can perform changes, so I think we should be civil more than attacking each other with sharp words , because if you kept feeling that way, you will gain nothing except the hate and you will translate that hate your kids and grand kids, but if each one of us tried his best to prevent the bad ideas we attack other with, then the next generation will have nothing to do with the other side except being nice

To Be Continued With His Replay:wobble:

باتونيان

25/04/2007, 07:01 PM

WOW.....!!
You've left nothing for me to say

As of 9/11 which we can view as the core of the problem wit this guy
and meny others.
Have you heard about "THE CONTROLLED DEMOLITION CONSPIRACY".....!! Its an americon theory by the way!

Listen for what John Kerry had to say when he was asked about it :"I do know that, that wall was in danger and they made a descison
based on that danger, that it had of destroying other things that they did it in a controlled fashion"!!:wobble:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wn4Yx1MTgfQ

Wise wise words from a politician and a lawyer who was one step of
becoming a president in 2004 :D

another study of this theory calling 9/11 as an illusion!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hb5i_D9DcEs

and from about 400 other videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WB3IvA8WCyo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vw7c3G4YOdg

What a prejudice in judging a muslim woman by her look!!
You did a good job in showing him our teachings about woman.
But first, I think that he shoud know about his Bible point of view on woman!!

was it in their Bible or in the Quran that it describe Eve by the verse "You are the devil's gateway,","the sting of the scorpion"
was it in the Quran or their Bible that woman aren't allowed to speak in public or teach : "it is a shame for women to speak in the church,"
Is it in Islam or in Christianity that you aren't allowed to divorce?
And in another verse a woman hand should be cut if touches anothers man private part :wobble:
If a woman grabs a man's privates during a fight, her hand is to be cut off. (Duet 25:11,12)”
and so on.......

Wardah

25/04/2007, 10:47 PM

Abu alruhail;

I still remember this "little" conversation with the American guy!
I liked it.

اسوارة الياسمين

26/04/2007, 04:30 PM

Im really proud of you Abu elruail, thanks for every word you wrote

cant wait to read his replay.

أبو الرحيل

27/04/2007, 01:22 PM

Wardah

27/04/2007, 03:17 PM

Hello Abu alruhail;
I have no idea where my spirit has gone?!
I guess I was just making the most of my freedom before starting the job!

Now I'm stuck at work but i'm still lurking time to time. :)

أبو الرحيل

27/04/2007, 05:45 PM

Hello Abu alruhail;
I have no idea where my spirit has gone?!
I guess I was just making the most of my freedom before starting the job!

Now I'm stuck at work but i'm still lurking time to time. :)
LOL....!!

well keep lurking till u get it back....!!! ^_^

Peace...!

أبو الرحيل

27/04/2007, 05:50 PM

His replay:

{{{

Christianity- I will start this by saying I am very bad at religion topics. I'm not a real religious person. Christianity started with the Jewish... Christianity to me is like the Muslim. Its hard to figure unless your pretty smart .There's an eastern Christianity I think and a western.. there's so many denominations of it there is no way I can know them all without study. Catholic, Protestant, Evangelism, Pentecostal, Baptist, the list goes on.There are alot on my list that are very educated on the religion. I know there is three like you said.. The Trinity (Father, son and holy spirit). Christians worship Jesus Christ...Like I said I'm not at all good with religion topics.
You said : don’t judge me by what others do even if they are my nation or they are in my side and as long as its not me who has done it then why are you taking me to the court and punishing me instead of them. Goes the same for me. I as a citizen cannot stop the bad. I cannot make people be civilized. I wish I could.

We all saw what did American's Christians do in "abu gharib" prison when they had sex and violated male Iraqis which are "Arabian Muslims.... granted that was bad... but they did leave with there head. There are many days that American prisoners are beheaded. Some how I feel that a bit brutal compared to taking photos of prisoners. The Americans that did this were also punished. I'm sure the ones that beheaded Eugene Armstrong this week were also.

If Bush is considered a terrorist... when the 9/11 incident happened what do you think he should have done. There are many that think he should have done nothing. What have happened if he did do nothing? Wonder what would be today..
you gotta understand that there is no "American Muslims and Arabian Muslims" there is one Islam, what American Muslims believe in, is the exact same what Arabian Muslims you say that but when you speak wit another Muslim they want to be addressed American Muslim. How the hell do you know what to do?
Saddam? Terrorist or no? Some Arabs cheered his death... others are wiling to commit suicide to be with him? Show me the logic?
Jihad-- I am no fan of Jihad. I think they are animalistic.. Just bread for numbers. I do not understand really .. All I know is what I have read and I have read alot.. Let me show you a movie you can tell me if you believe it to be fact or fiction.

http://www.alainsnewsletter.com/s/spip.php?article248
Watch those and tell me .... How are we to know what to believe. We don't speak the language, so we assume the kids in the video are saying what the translator says?? Is that not a race of people taught hatred. Enlighten me.

http://www.truthnet.org/islam/Islamic-Justice/index.htm
Is this true or is it not?
You gotta understand, that it is forbidden to kill in Islam, that’s the general rule in Islam, and who kills will deserve the death penalty,
So there is no Islamic Army? I thought the Turkish, Kurds were against the Islam army... like I said I thought. I read Islam online....Its the media yes...So maybe not fact

All what America doing is preventing anything harmful will happen to the Jewish,
Plus lets face it, there are more than 1 billion Muslims all over the world who are ready to enter the war against Israel, so sooner or later this war will happen, and what is delaying it is the protection of the US
But Muslims don't kill? So how will they take Israel without death? Islam doesn't kill so they cant join an army?
USA has been in Afghanistan for almost now 6 years and up till today they can not say we are winning! While they are fighting people who hold wooden stick!
Afghanistan. I have talked about Afghanistan in political forums and chats till I'm blue.. The Taliban and al-Qaeda and Osama bin laden too. Osama bin laden is a murder who wants to take the United States and we just are not ready for that. He has publicly said that there will be more attacks on the US. Do you consider that terms for war, or should we wait to see if he's serious? Maybe his attacks will not be to bad?

Bin Laden said the message was being delivered directly to the American people, saying the attacks of September 11, 2001 were the result of U.S. foreign policy in Arab lands, specifically referring to Lebanon and the Palestinians. The terror attacks killed nearly 3,000 people Bin Laden said this.... his own words.. Then people say no war... be sure he is quality? He said he did it? WTH? He said he is planning more attacks. Bush is a terrorist for going after him?
Your security is not in the hands of Kerry or Bush or al Qaeda. Your security is in your own hands. Any nation that does not attack us will not be attacked," <<<< Bin Laden words, not mine
there are 22 Arabian countries and Oman is one of them, have you ever seen an Omani in the news for doing something bad in America I don't know about Oman... Again I personally am not blaming anyone. I am only asking of the questions Americans have in knowing what it good what's is not what is Anti- US... How do we know. I see Muslims and all races here I never give it a thought. I don't care if your Hindu, Buddhist it makes me no difference. I am not prejudice ,I don't care your race. But I do like to know when someone says Jihad-- what exactly that means. When someone says sheite. .or how ever its spelled I just like to half know what I'm talking about.

If an American was there burning a Islam flag if there even is one what would happen? In the US anyone can burn the US flag its ok your free, your choice. There do you openly speak of how you disagree with your own government? Do you protest in the streets of disagreement with your government? What would happen if you ?
When you think you have the right to ask where those Arabians from,... In the US we are not supposed to question as to where the foreigners are from in our own country because that would be considered rude or prejudice. If an American is strolling though your streets....They don't ask where he's from-- what would they do?

History of the US I always thought came from Britain.. Paris There was only 13 states then... new Nations which was United states of America.. London was the first trips to the US I always thought it was the Brits first Ill be reading on that too lol. I am curious
I really have reread and reread this page and will probably do so over. Your point are very good ones on some and I love to talk about this too as you can see. What I don't know I want to know. If your post is open to the public I will put your post to the people so they can give you opinions... Some there love to discuss this too. They are all very polite and just wanting knowledge. Great post. Ill come back when my brain stops smoking.

Your Friend.. "

}}}

To Be Continued with my replay....!!!;)

اسوارة الياسمين

27/04/2007, 11:45 PM

His replay:

History of the US I always thought came from Britain.. Paris There was only 13 states then... new Nations which was United states of America.. London was the first trips to the US I always thought it was the Brits first Ill be reading on that too lol. I am curious
I really have reread and reread this page and will probably do so over. Your point are very good ones on some and I love to talk about this too as you can see. What I don't know I want to know. If your post is open to the public I will put your post to the people so they can give you opinions... Some there love to discuss this too. They are all very polite and just wanting knowledge. Great post. Ill come back when my brain stops smoking.

Your Friend.. "

}}}

To Be Continued with my replay....!!!;)

Did he said great post, wasn't he the one who accused us to be whores, rats and dogs....

أبو الرحيل

28/04/2007, 08:58 PM

Did he said great post, wasn't he the one who accused us to be whores, rats and dogs....
LOL...!!

You better get used to that with these kind of people....!!!

Peace...!! ^_^

أبو الرحيل

28/04/2007, 10:01 PM

My replay was:

{{{

"(You Worry Me) was emailed to me. I posted it to see if there was answers to these feelings."

First off, the title was directed to Arabs, that’s how I guessed the writer -whether it was you or anyone else- asking Arabs those questions. Second, it doesn’t matter actually who wrote that cuz these ideas seems to be into a lot of Americans' heads, and I can see that from the replays for your post! I will get to your question on "where and how can we understand each other"…!!!
Yes you are right, that the first thing we –the Muslims- have to believe or any Muslim is "there is no god except Allah and Mohammed is his prophet", but that’s not enough.. you have also to understand what do Muslims mean when they say there is no god except Allah, you have to understand what does Mohammed is his prophet mean! The first thing you should know that we are not required to just say words so will go to heaven, perhaps all what you are asked to do there is to say Allah has a son and heaven will be guaranteed for ya..!!
when you say there is no god deserve praying except Allah that means that your soul, your money, your kids, everything in this life under Allah's word,…and where can I find his words, then I will answer you in the Koran, and you will ask what If the Koran didn’t mention about it, then that’s the part when you believed that Mohamed is his prophet and since he is a prophet then every single part of his living kind was a praying and I have to be just like him. Yeah all the main things in this life you will find in there.. maybe some new mini issues has appeared right away, but if you work your mind according to the Koran direction then you will find the answer so easily even for these little details.
Anyways! About Arabs, as I said before you have to understand that Arabs is something and Islam is something else, Arabs are a civilization that has been there even before Islam comes to them…!! And just because the prophet of Islam is Arabic, doesn’t mean the religion is only for Arabs, and the principles of Islam are the best prove for that!
Plus if it is for Arabs only then you wouldn’t see from the west to the east and from the north to the south people are attending to it! That’s one thing!

"Christianity- I will start this by saying I am very bad at religion topics. Im not a real religious person. Christianty started with the Jewish... Christianity to me is like the muslim. Its hard to figure unless your pretty smart"
You have to understand that a religion should not be that hard to understand if it sent from the perfect creator who wants to guard you, if Allah wanted to tell you something why would he make his words so hard to understand.! Doesn’t that make you wonder?! If Allah loves us , and that saying is filled in the new bible , but if he does love us then why are we lost and you have to spend like tens of years to understand such a concept! There was no doubt that there was a Christianity and there is no doubt that the messenger who sent with it is Jesus-peace be upon him-. And a Muslim who deny Christianity , is not a Muslim, cuz Christianity was the continuing of Allah's words, till it was ended in the Islam! As I said before it doesn’t bother me what do you believe in, cuz what do you believe in is for you not for me!
Your question about " If Bush is considered a terrorist... when the 9/11 incident happened what do you think he should have done. There are many that think he should have done nothng.What have happened if he did do nothing? Wonder what would be today." What he should do and how, is not my job, you guys voted for him to be your president, to be the one that represent America, so whatever he does is what you guys do in the world's eyes. Bush has made of Bin ladin a hero after he was a criminal , and correct me if I am wrong, in more than once bush said in the news that his war is a religious war, I remember that day very well, which meant Christianity against Islam..! Bush is not fighting criminals no matter what they believe in, he is fighting a whole religion and its believers, and when I say bush that means America. Let me here open your mind for something about what have bush should done!
First of all, as a powerful country leader, you should be fair to the whole world, even with your "vetos", the UN couldn’t blame Israel for its crimes against Palestinians since 1945 up till today because of the American Vito, no one could’ve blamed Israel for its last aggressive crime against the innocent Lebanon's because of the American's Vito ..!! this is just a simple example for the Leader on how he should be fair!
And don’t get me started talking about the latest technology of the US in the military are tested on the Palestinians bodies..! after that you will ask what should have Bush done!

you should understand for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Another thing is, Bin ladin has learnt every techniques in the US,..! where was USA all these years from him..??! and is finding a criminal means messing up a whole country and destroying everything in their country and arresting everyone and removing the word "smile" from their county?!
"Saddam? Terrorist or no? Some Arabs cheered his death... others are wiling to commit suicide to be with him? Show me the logic?"

About Saddam, you have to know that Saddam was the spoiled baby of the US since the 80s, he was supported from the US in his war against Iran, and between a night and a day he was the worst guy in the history who should be removed from earth by the US,..! can you actually buy that?!
But what if I told you that Saddam has started to be a threat to Israel and its " supremacy" over the middle east, and this is why they want to drag Iran right away now! I am not defending Saddam here but from your point of view what does the war against Iraq has anything to do with the attack of 11/9..!!
lets assume the right for America to invade Afghanistan –which in no way that can be acceptable- but why after Afghanistan then Iraq and after Iraq now Iran and after Iran then Syria…etc –focus the only relation between these countries that they are Muslim countries-! And I will show you the logic in Saddam:
Saddam is just like the rest of the Arabians Muslim leaders, he gets the support from the US to be a human god that his nation has to bow to him and kiss his toes -just exactly like the rest of the Arabian presidents- even if the style is different from this Arabian country and that one! When the US decided to drag him down, that’s cuz he started to threat the US with his country's oil, which will immediately effect the economy of Israel! So there has got to make a big step to prevent that and there was no way except invading the country!
Haven’t you asked yourself if one of the biggest oil productive countries which is Iraq, got invaded then shouldn’t the oil stocks get down, how come the US, one of the popular " customer" for the middle east oil didn’t get effected! The first thing the US did when it invaded Iraq was guarding the oil wells, it didn’t care about the people or whatsoever, they came for an aim and they got under a blanket of helping people…! The Iraqis didn’t realize what are Americans here for, so they were cheering at the very first days for America but when they realized what they are here for, they took their weapon and stepped against them, and for doing that they are called terrorists,!
same goes with Saddam's death:
I believe that Saddam deserve the death penalty even without a court, but not under the name of America's democracy, cuz I have seen enough of its democracy! Now the Iraqis are lost, some knows that he deserve the death penalty but should it be under the " supervision " of America, they rather his unfair life than that! While others don’t care how he die and under what kind of rules as long as he deserves it!

أبو الرحيل

28/04/2007, 10:03 PM

"When someone says sheite..or how ever its spelled I just like to half know what Im talking about."
– by the way, if you are interested, I can also explain to you the story from A to Z about this argument between the sunnit and the sheeat!-

About the "sunni" and "sheeat" fight right there now!
Ask yourself this question! This fight hasn’t started even in Saddam's period! How come it has sparked up when the Americans arrived!?!
America is the liberal country who has protected Israel from every single war since 1945 , cant prevent a small fight between two groups of people! Can you really buy that?!
But as I told you before! They are not there to help! They are there for an aim of the oil and Israel but they know now that they are stuck, cuz if they left just like that they will look so bad in the world's eyes, or since the world knows America nowadays, then you can say they are scared that everything they brought in the media will be refused if they left right now!

Let me tell you something here! This oil is Muslim's treasure! And those people who are been killed and raped and violated are Muslim's people! This land that has been invaded is a Muslim land! So try to wonder on that for some seconds!

About the videos! I watched all of them! ..that was a good opening for my morning.. LOL!

First of all! Did you realize that most of these scenes are from Palestine, Lebanon, Pakistan, and Egypt! Relate what is the US policy on these countries and with their reactions! And most of these scenes I have seen them before! And they were cut out of the context so they will mean something else, I will show you what I mean:
If I said " I always fight for my principles" and you took the phrase " I always fight" only and broadcast it to whoever you wanted then I will look like a bad person, but if you took my whole saying " I always fight for my principles" then the picture will look different.. dontcha agree?!And remember most of these scenes when they are screaming "death to America or death to Israel," are when they are in a war with them or after a speech that USA made in the media or..etc

About the Hitler's, I have one question only and no more?
What was Hitler's religion?! Find out that! It was so clear to see that the aim of the videos to tell in other words that Muslims are the Hitler's, aren’t I right?!

And What do you expect from a kid when he was born with his stolen rights of being with his parents, with having an education and going to school, with having a loving family?! You think he is gonna ask for a doll to play with or a gun to get his rights back?!
He will simply ask, who is behind my stolen rights, they will answer him, Israel, and he will say lets fight then, they say wait, there is America behind it? Then He will nod! .. now be fair and ask who is responsible for what he will do?!

You guys are interesting, you support Israel with the weapons, with the policy, with everything, what is left is to perform the action but u let Israel to do it and then when you get asked why are you doing that, you will answer sarcastically, its not me, they are doing it!

Just to open your mind into something!
Before! Only Palestinians whose kids are ready to step up against the US! But now there is Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq and our old wound, Palestinians!

How can you teach a kid to be peaceful if he saw you killing his parents, and destroying his home, raping his sisters, and stealing all of his rights with his own eyes?!
So you will just have to tell them that your fate to never have a childhood! You are soldiers from the day you are born…!

"So there is no Islamic Army? I thought the Turkish, Kurds were against the Islam army... like I said I thought. I read Islam online....Its the media yes...So maybe not fact"

I didn’t say there is no Islamic Army?! Or should I say, there wont be an Islamic army But I want you to go read what its description in the Koran!

Turkish and Kurds problem is very simple! Both are fighting to get the chair of the kingdom, both claim they have discovered a new Islam called the "Modern Islam", which is a very long topic I can share with ya if you are interested! But in a brief answer! Neither Turkey or Kurds represent Islam, cuz they have changed one main rule which is Allah's words are above any kind of words, during the changing of the place and the changing of the time! About the link of the kid:
First of all let me tell you this:
In Islam all kids from all the religions, as long as they haven’t reached the age of being an adult, they all are in heaven, they are heavenly kids, no matter what they believe in! and under that rule of Islam, they are excused for doing any sin, no matter how big it is..!! yeah the rule is that you have to discipline your kids, but if they kill, they rape, they steal.. etc , they wont be punished as adults, yes in Islam, who steals, his hands will be cut, and who kill will be killed and who rape, then he will get 80 hit in his back, that’s if he isn't married but if he was married and had sex with another woman then his punishment is the death penalty! And who cheat his wife will have a special kind of way to be killed!..( if you wanted to disscus anything about this topic I am all ears for your questions and inquiries)!
So that’s why its so hard for me to believe that picture you brought in the other link,.. but to save your time..
Lets assume that picture is true, there are hundred of pictures of Christians who are raping 4 years old girls, and moreover they kill them after they rape them? What I am telling you are facts, lets go together me and you to the US courts and ask them for such cases like that!
I told you before and I am telling you now! Don’t blame a religion by his believer's attitudes, and if you insist to, then Christianity will look even worst than believing in no god at all!

أبو الرحيل

28/04/2007, 10:07 PM

When you asked "But Muslims dont kill? So how will they take Isreal without death? Islam doesnt kill so they cant join an amy?"
Sweetheart, Muslims don’t kill when you don’t kill, Muslims don’t kill when you are looking for peace! Not when you are invading their countries and raping their women and stealing their oil!

As I told you before, Islam is a religion that came to improve its believers for the best, to be in the best quality of a person you can imagine!

You have to know that its forbidden in Islam to cut a tree, just for fun..!! "I am not kidding!" and the penalty that mentioned for the person who cuts a tree for fun will go to hell immediately, same goes with pets, but when it comes to pets, if you just agonize a cat then you are going to hell as fast as you don’t imagine too! This is when I said Muslims don’t kill, our rule at first is peace, don’t mess anything in this world for fun!

but when it comes to my right, then there is not such a loser who will give his rights because he is scared of dying or whatever is the reason!
When it comes to my rights, you have two choices, either to give me my right or to give up your soul! Two options not a third for them! Don’t invade my land and steal my oil and rape my women and then say lets have a table and discuss about peace! First give me my rights back then yeah lets discuss! What kind of threats do I look like when you steal my rights is your problem!

And to make what I am saying here clear, in the "Jihad" word, which is making every single American flipping out when they hear that word, we have so many rules for it, but let me tell you one of them which is the nearest to the realistic that you have seen, read and heard about lately:

The war that has just ended between Israel and Lebanon, or should I be more specific and say between Israel and Muslims! : the Muslims in that war didn’t kill except soldiers, and when they fired their jets, they fired it at Military targets! But on the other hand, Israel was releasing its American bombs in towns that filled with citizens, they killed women and kids, and the huge amount of the deaths was women and babies! If you don’t believe me! Just Google it and see it with your own eyes right now!

After that you wanted Muslims to distribute flowers cuz they believe in a peace religion?!!! We don’t kill when you step back from anything called "Muslims rights" , by then I will believe that you are looking for peace, I will believe you are not meaning to attack Islam or Muslims by anyway!

And if you looked back for the " Muslims rights" then you wouldn’t find more than, what anyone in this world right without looking at what he believes in healso will call it his rights, isn't ( your land, your money, your way of praying.. etc) are your rights!

In the videos you gave me the link before…!! There was a lady saying we want Arabs saying we love America, we want to see Arabs to waves the American flag…etc

I will do all of that, if the US has the guts for only one time to condemn the last carnage that Israel performed in Palestine two days ago!

Remember, don’t ask we want this and we want that without asking what can I give to make you doing this or that??!

I forgot to mention one important point over there:

1-We don’t hate Jewish because they are Jewish, I told you that we hate them and we consider them as enemies who stole our land and our peace!

2- when the Koran described Jewish as the grand kids of pigs and monkeys cuz what they have done to the prophets and pursuiting them wasn’t something forgivable , take a second and just imagine Jesus getting chased to be killed by those Jewish! How would you feel?!
Their crime is inexcusable , and yet Allah gave them a chance to live this life and that’s from his fairness and his mercy otherwise , when he want to remove any souls from this life, he will just say the word "be" and it will be done!

3- the allowing of a Muslim guy to marry a Jewish lady is the biggest evidence for what I am saying here!

4-when you see in the media or wherever, this phrase " Death to Jewish", then they meant Israel, cuz it’s the only country in the world that known by its religion and that’s one of the things that should make you wonder! "Seriously"!

5- the hate for the US came from its standing with Israel, which means it believes what Israel believes in, so that’s when " Death to Israel" was followed with " Death to America"!

-------------------------------------------------------------

"If an American was there burning a Islam flag if there even is one what would happen? In the US anyone can burn the US flag its ok your free, your choice. There do you openly speak of how you disagree with your own government? Do you protest in the streets of disagreement with your government? What would happen if you ?"

Sweetheart, if you burnt a flag of an Arabian country in their country, then nothing will happen to you cuz you are the nephew of the mother that is breast-feeding our presidents! But if I did it in any of the Arabian countries then you will see my body is torn up as a dog's meat!!
We can NOT disagree with our governments here, and we have two choices either to agree or drink from the water sea! Cuz our idea is the exact opposite of what those presidents wants!
Its interesting you mentioned that so I can tell you some facts about some of the Arabian presidents!
the presidents of the Arabs living in a heaven that you can not imagine! One of them spend 80 million dollar PER DAY..!! and each summer he goes to Spain or any European country to(……………)!! ( I will let you complete and I am agreeing from now)
and if you are really interested then I can write to you about them FOREVER and your eyes will pop out when you know about them!
Now the questions are :
1-isn't it weird that those presidents are immortal presidents which nothing will take them off the kingdom chair except "death"
2-who is behind that? – a hint is the US-
3-what are Americans soldiers, armies, navies and marines doing in all of those Arabian countries and why are they here?!
4-Would America accept any of those "Arabian's" soldiers or military to be in the US…! Why the reverse is acceptable then!
5-Why Bush keeps calling the gulf countries " our friends" countries while, their nations wishing his death like wishing the devil to go to hell!
6-Read all these questions and try to find the answers by yourself! If you got lost! I will answer you with a huge smile!

}}}

To Be Continued with a 40 years old woman replay...!!:rolleyes:

أبو الرحيل

01/05/2007, 09:17 AM

Her Replay was;
{{{
"I always said if you are not a terrorist and do not follow those Muslim Can you at least point it out more so?Christianity as people out see is close to what you say because people who say they are Christian are not real Christians. So what you pointed out are the so called Christians who have not given their heart ,soul and mind to Christ.Christmas is the day we set a side to honor the brithday of Jesus.are not killing your brothers and sisters in Iraq,The history goes like this we recieved a letter from a group of people in iraq a few years back tell us how bad it was there and asking us for help. It took us this long to bring help to them.wine is not forbidden ..you got that wrong. redo your research! Jesus made wine at the wedding. the bible talks about hard drunk which is not created out of grape but other stuff. That is forbidden or show not be drunk.Plus I read the karon after each paragraph it says to kill the ones who do bot follow the teaching. So killing is okay to do in the koran...."

}}}

To Be Continuned with My Last Replay...!!!lol ^_^

أبو الرحيل

02/05/2007, 09:00 AM

My Replay was:

{{{

"I always said if you are not a terrorist and do not follow those Muslim Can you at least point it out more so?"
First, pardon me to correct that…. you didn’t always say that, you started to make yourself believing that after the attack of 9/11…!
another thing is, Muslims didn’t call themselves terrorists, so they have to find you out how to get you out of that box that filled of question marks?!
The media got you believing that all Muslims are terrorists and their religion is a terrorism religion! But when you faced it in real! You found out that its wrong! But you couldn’t change the believe that the media got you to believe in so you got lost! We didn’t call ourselves terrorist so we have to tell you how to differ between the terrorist and Muslims!
Your media did so you should ask it that question?! And we didn’t call Islam a terrorism religion so you will get lost when you find out that it is the most peaceful religion on this world!
You guys are controlled by the Media in the United States, so when the media tells you to go left, you will go left and when it tells you to go right , you will go to the right, without knowing anything about where you going!
The media made you believe that Arabs are dying to live in America and they want to be Americans as soon as possible and that’s all because of the freedom Americans have and because of their religion…..etc,
a lot of those ideas are released in the US media, but most of these ideas are wrong!
Most Arabs in the US are either because they are "exiled" from their origin countries or they are there to make money! And when it comes to make money then Arabs and non-Arabs understand the one only language which is the dollar language!
We didn’t deny the excitement when you meet a person from another nation, but that’s not because of the reasons that your media is getting you to believe in!
This excitement is something normal with all the kind of people!
Wouldn’t you be excited if u went to Japan, or Australia or any other part of the world, because you know a new person mean a new culture, a new thoughts,.. etc, and just knowing them will make you excited!
For Arabs, they are invaded by the English people (UK and USA) as well as the French, so you can see that, they already know the language,( since they are forced to learn in schools) so the excitement of knowing the other side will just appear itself.
Humans will always be humans, so there are some common things between them that you can not just accuse religions because of its reaction to get to your aims!
"Christianity as people out see is close to what you say because people who say they are Christian are not real Christians. So what you pointed out are the so called Christians who have not given their heart ,soul and mind to Christ."

If you say so but Even though, I don’t see the point of them going around Jewish belief while they call themselves Christians unless they are not! Without looking at what the believers doing or behaving, your principles should be out clear and obvious! When you say this is wrong, then it should work on all the other kind of people, it should mean the word "wrong" in all people, whether they are Muslims, Jewish or Christians, and actually it should work even on those who believe that rocks are their god or those " atheist".

For example, when you throw the word "terrorist" at a killer, don’t tell me that the American "Christian " soldier not a terrorist when he kills an innocent woman or an innocent boy in Iraq, and don’t tell me the Israeli Soldier when he kills a 1 years old baby, not a terrorist but you will say Osama bin Ladin is a terrorist because he killed innocents in the attack of 9/11..!!
In Islam, we called the three of them are terrorists, not according to what they believe but according to what they did!

In the Christianity, they called the Christian " helper" , the Jewish " fighting for his "rights", and the Muslim " a terrorist" , according to what they believe!

I hope you do get what I am trying to say here!

"Christmas is the day we set a side to honor the brithday of Jesus" ,first of all, when I talked about Christmas, I was answering his question, that there is nothing in it to be jealous of , or to hate for! But since you are trying to answer then here:
Could you tell me when's Jesus birthday exactly, and why some kind of Christians disagree with others about his birthday, while they believe in the same bible and the same Jesus!
And since it’s a day for honor, don’t you think that it should be all about honesty and honor! Why would you teach your kids about a myth in an honor day, instead of teaching them who is Jesus! but since there is nothing to tell about except he is a son of a god and that’s it, then they brought a myth that will keep most of the people busy with, which is Santa claus!
What is quite odd that in the Koran , it says he was born in the "dates" –the fruit- harvest , which is always at summer while you guys celebrate his birthday at winter!

أبو الرحيل

02/05/2007, 09:02 AM

"We are not killing your brothers and sisters in Iraq."
An opinion I respect!
Of course a killer wont admit he killed, and a rapist wont admit his crime. but from 250 million people in America I bet my life that 200 million would disagree with ya!
"The history goes like this we recieved a letter from a group of people in iraq a few years back tell us how bad it was there and asking us for help. It took us this long to bring help to them."
That’s funny cuz this is my first time hearing this claim, I heard the "Destructive weapons" claim, which Bush kept repeating it, till the CIA has proved 100% that there was no "Destructive weapons" at all, so he went with the "bad guy" claim!
But you could be…………' right', could you find me more infos about this letter and its details as well as who sent it…! Bring me names, facts, numbers, dates,…etc of this letter you r talking about!

"wine is not forbidden ..you got that wrong. redo your research! Jesus made wine at the wedding. the bible talks about hard drunk which is not created out of grape but other stuff. That is forbidden or show not be drunk."
1-in the Christianity itself, some kinds of it disagree with what you have said above because they are saying that the bible forbid the "wine"

2-if Jesus made wine, and in ur claim he is the "son of god", then what is left for the followers of him to do! Without looking at the religion , you know that making wine is most of the time is done by a certain kind of people( I don’t know how to describe them, cuz I don’t want to offend anyone), but the people we look at an ideal people, we never think that they drink wine do we!

3-and if those followers were drinking wine, then how can you trust of a single word in that bible since it was written by them, a wine drinker can not differ between lots of things while he is drunk.

4-notice that anything Christians want, they will bend it to Jesus and the bible. For examples:
* if you look back 50 or 100 years ago, then with Christians, sex was forbidden between a boyfriend and a girlfriend, but since the desire couldn’t resist, they had to first say the bible is allowing it so no one will mind it and no one will search in it since its over the brain's ability to understand.
* gays and lesbians are using the same way to get some respect from others, they went to the bible and brought two or three lines from there and said god doesn’t mind being ! And what amazed me the huge number of Christians who bought that!
* what was left just the "worrying" of going to hell and heaven , and to make it sounds fine, they said just believe that there is a son of god and you are going to heaven.

For Muslims, its hard for us to believe that Jesus even smelled something called wine because we know his description, and prophets like him, were busy on how to tell you what god allowed and what he forbid instead of making wine at weddings!
You see Muslims tend to exalt prophets as much as possible, while they are humans, on the other hand, Christians tend to insult Prophets as much as possible while they see them as "sons of gods", I am wondering who would have the gut to draw Jesus picture half naked! A Christian wont accept to be viewed in public that way then how can he allow himself to do that to a prophet!

"Plus I read the karon after each paragraph it says to kill the ones who do bot follow the teaching. So killing is okay to do in the koran."

The Koran talked about many things such as: inheritance ,marriage, the believe of one god, prophets… and the Islam war "jihad"..!
And you couldn’t find anything to read in the Koran in your first time except the "holy war" and from that you made your impression, but even so..
you have to understand first that the Koran is a perfect book that not a single letter in it written by a human whether he is a prophet or a believer! And as a perfect book it has mentioned everything to Muslims, like: how to smile, how to walk, how to talk, how to behave, how to treat the wife, how to treat the husband, how to treat the neighbor, how to eat, how to sleep, how to pray, how to trade, how to sell, how to buy, and of course how to fight in the war!
Because it’s a peace religion then it has to tell its believers how to fight in the war so when they enter any of them, they wont turn the war to a revenge! And I read the Koran and I haven’t read what you have mentioned , so to make what you have said correct, bring me what you have read and I will tell you what it means! It doesn’t have to be me who tell you that (lol), you can ask there any Muslims to tell you what it means!
On the other hand, go read your history about "Christians" and find out what they have done when they enter a war! And go read Torah pentateuch Old Testament, (which are changed from the origin one) and find me out what they have said to its believers when they get in a war!
You will understand what does terrorism means when you will read that!